<div dir="ltr"><div>Happy New Year, Simon.</div><div> </div><div>Thank you for pointing to me the I0 estimate procedure.I saw an application rtki0estimation</div><div>under the Applications folder. Is this the tool you meant? I ran it using all default parameters</div><div>providing with the original projection data. What I obtained was a file: i0est_histogram.csv.</div><div>From the comments in rtki0estimation.ggo this file is the output with I0 estimate. For 650 projections</div><div>the file size is around 200MB. I used excel to open the file and found that the beginning two numbers</div><div>64408 and 722024 then followed by 0's. In the middle there are some nonzero numbers. Essentially</div><div>all zeros. </div><div>Since there is not much description of the application, so it is hard to figure out easily what I am doing.</div><div>I tried to read the source code, but it might be more useful if you can give some hints on how to </div><div>use it. </div><div> </div><div>Regards,</div><div>-howard</div><div> </div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 1:49 AM, Simon Rit <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:simon.rit@creatis.insa-lyon.fr" target="_blank">simon.rit@creatis.insa-lyon.fr</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Happy new year Howard,<br>
Normally, this calibration is handled by the flat panel. It uses an<br>
air projection and a dark (no beam) projection to compute the line<br>
integral. However, there might be fluctuations in time of these two<br>
projections. Some people do regular acquisitions of them to capture<br>
the time fluctuations. Otherwise, a constant value might be a good<br>
solution. Sébastien has recently implemented an automated<br>
determination of this constant, maybe you should have a look:<br>
<a href="http://www.openrtk.org/Doxygen/classrtk_1_1I0EstimationProjectionFilter.html" target="_blank">http://www.openrtk.org/Doxygen/classrtk_1_1I0EstimationProjectionFilter.html</a><br>
It is already part of the mini-pipeline for ImagX / IBA projections processing:<br>
<a href="http://www.openrtk.org/Doxygen/classrtk_1_1ImagXRawToAttenuationImageFilter.html" target="_blank">http://www.openrtk.org/Doxygen/classrtk_1_1ImagXRawToAttenuationImageFilter.html</a><br>
<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">Simon<br>
</font></span><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
On Fri, Jan 2, 2015 at 10:17 PM, Howard <<a href="mailto:lomahu@gmail.com">lomahu@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> Happy New Year, Cyril.<br>
><br>
> I realized that our projection data is having some issues with air<br>
> correction. We checked our calibration and it appeared fine. Do you know by<br>
> any chance whether there is a quick way of correcting that? I searched<br>
> around and found people used a constant air norm image.<br>
><br>
> Thanks very much,<br>
> -howard<br>
><br>
> On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Cyril Mory<br>
> <<a href="mailto:cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr">cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Hi Howard,<br>
>><br>
>> I've taken a look at your data.<br>
>> You can apply tv denoising on the out.mha volume and obtain a<br>
>> significantly lower level of noise without blurring structures by using the<br>
>> following command :<br>
>> rtktotalvariationdenoising -i out.mha -g 0.001 -o<br>
>> tvdenoised/gamma0.001.mha -n 100<br>
>><br>
>> I was unable to obtain good results with iterative reconstruction from the<br>
>> projection data you sent, though. I think the main reason for this is that<br>
>> your projections have much-higher-than-zero attenuation in air. Your<br>
>> calculation of i0 when converting from intensity to attenuation is probably<br>
>> not good enough. Try to correct for this effect first. Then you can start<br>
>> performing SART and Conjugate Gradient reconstructions on your data, and<br>
>> once you get these right, play with ADMM.<br>
>><br>
>> You might need to remove the table from the projections to be able to<br>
>> restrict the reconstruction volume strictly to the patient, and speed up the<br>
>> computations. We can provide help for that too.<br>
>><br>
>> Best regards,<br>
>> Cyril<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> On 12/17/2014 05:02 PM, Howard wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Hi Cyril,<br>
>><br>
>> I've sent you two files via <a href="http://wetransfer.com" target="_blank">wetransfer.com</a>: one is the sparse projection<br>
>> set with geometry file and the other is the fdk reconstructed image based on<br>
>> full projection set. Please let me know if you have trouble receiving them.<br>
>><br>
>> Thanks very much for looking into this.<br>
>><br>
>> -Howard<br>
>><br>
>> On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 10:19 AM, Cyril Mory<br>
>> <<a href="mailto:cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr">cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr</a>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> Hi Howard,<br>
>>><br>
>>> Thanks for the detailed feedback.<br>
>>> The image getting blurry is typically due to a too high gamma. Depending<br>
>>> on you data, gamma can have to be set to a very small value (I use 0.007 in<br>
>>> some reconstructions on clinical data). Can you send over your volume<br>
>>> reconstructed from full projection data, and I'll have a quick look ?<br>
>>><br>
>>> There is a lot of instinct in the setting of the parameters. With time,<br>
>>> one gets used to finding a correct set of parameters without really knowing<br>
>>> how. I can also try to reconstruct from your cbct data if you send me the<br>
>>> projections and the geometry.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Best regards,<br>
>>> Cyril<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> On 12/17/2014 03:49 PM, Howard wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> Hi Cyril,<br>
>>><br>
>>> Thanks very much for your detailed and nice description on how to use the<br>
>>> admmtv reconstruction. I followed your suggestions and re-ran<br>
>>> reconstructions using admmtotalvariation and admmwavelets with cbct<br>
>>> projection data from a thoracic patient.<br>
>>><br>
>>> I am reporting what I found and hope these will give you information for<br>
>>> further improvement.<br>
>>><br>
>>> 1. I repeated admmtotalvariation with 30 iterations. No improvement was<br>
>>> observed. As a matter of fact, the reconstructed image is getting a lot<br>
>>> noiser compared to that using 3 iterations. The contrast is getting worse as<br>
>>> well. I tried to play around with window & level in case I was fooled but<br>
>>> apparently more iterations gave worse results.<br>
>>><br>
>>> 2. Similarly I ran 30 iterations using admmwavelets. Slightly better<br>
>>> reconstruction compared with total variation.<br>
>>><br>
>>> 3. Then I went ahead to test if TV benefits us anything using the<br>
>>> tvdenoising application on the fdk-reconstructed image reconstructed from<br>
>>> full projection set. I found that the more iterations, the more blurry the<br>
>>> image became. For example, with 50 iterations the contrast on the denoised<br>
>>> image is very low so that the vertebrae and surrounding soft tissue are<br>
>>> hardly distinguishable. Changing gamma's at 0.2, 0.5, 1.0, 10 did not seem<br>
>>> to make a difference on the image. With 5 iterations the denoising seems to<br>
>>> work fairly well. Again, changing gamma's didn't make a difference.<br>
>>> I hope I didn't misused the totalvariationdenoising application. The<br>
>>> command I executed was: rtktotalvariationdenoising -i out.mha -o<br>
>>> out_denoising_n50_gamma05 --gamma 0.5 -n 50<br>
>>><br>
>>> In summary, tdmmwavelets seems perform better than tdmmtotalvariation but<br>
>>> neither gave satisfactory results. No sure what we can infer from the TV<br>
>>> denoising study. I could send my study to you if there is a need. Please let<br>
>>> me know what tests I could run. Further help on improvement is definitely<br>
>>> welcome and appreciated.<br>
>>><br>
>>> -Howard<br>
>>><br>
>>> On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 4:07 AM, Cyril Mory<br>
>>> <<a href="mailto:cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr">cyril.mory@creatis.insa-lyon.fr</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Hello Howard,<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Good to hear that you're using RTK :)<br>
>>>> I'll try to answer all your questions, and give you some advice:<br>
>>>> - In general, you can expect some improvement over rtkfdk, but not a<br>
>>>> huge one<br>
>>>> - You can find the calculations in my PhD thesis<br>
>>>> <a href="https://tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/tel-00985728" target="_blank">https://tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/tel-00985728</a> (in English. Only the<br>
>>>> introduction is in French)<br>
>>>> - Adjusting the parameters is, in itself, a research topic (sorry !).<br>
>>>> Alpha controls the amount of regularization and only that (the higher, the<br>
>>>> more regularization). Beta, theoretically, should only change the<br>
>>>> convergence speed, provided you do an infinite number of iterations (I know<br>
>>>> it doesn't help, sorry again !). In practice, beta is ubiquitous and appears<br>
>>>> everywhere in the calculations, therefore it is hard to predict what effect<br>
>>>> an increase/decrease of beta will give on the images. I would keep it as is,<br>
>>>> and play on alpha<br>
>>>> - 3 iterations is way too little. I typically used 30 iterations. Using<br>
>>>> the CUDA forward and back projectors helped a lot maintain the computation<br>
>>>> time manageable<br>
>>>> - The quality of the results depends a lot on the nature of the image<br>
>>>> you are trying to reconstruct. In a nutshell, the algorithm assumes that the<br>
>>>> image you are reconstructing has a certain form of regularity, and discards<br>
>>>> the potential solutions that do not have it. This assumption partly<br>
>>>> compensates for the lack of data. ADMM TV assumes that the image you are<br>
>>>> reconstructing is piecewise constant, i.e. has large uniform areas separated<br>
>>>> by sharp borders. If your image is a phantom, it should give good results.<br>
>>>> If it is a real patient, you should probably change to another algorithm<br>
>>>> that assumes another form of regularity in the images (try rtkadmmwavelets)<br>
>>>> - You can find out whether you typical images can benefit from TV<br>
>>>> regularization by reconstructing from all projections with rtkfdk, then<br>
>>>> applying rtktotalvariationdenoising on the reconstructed volume (try 50<br>
>>>> iterations and adjust the gamma parameter: high gamma means high<br>
>>>> regularization). If this denoising implies an unacceptable loss of quality,<br>
>>>> stay away from TV for these images, and try wavelets<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I hope this helps<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Looking forward to reading you again,<br>
>>>> Cyril<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> On 12/12/2014 06:42 PM, Howard wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I am testing the ADMM total variation reconstruction with sparse data<br>
>>>> sample. I could reconstruct but the results were not as good as expected. In<br>
>>>> other words, it didn't show much improvement compared to fdk reconstruction<br>
>>>> using the same sparse projection data.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> The parameters I used in ADMMTV were the following:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> --spacing 2,2,2 --dimension 250,100,250 --alpha 1 --beta 1000 -n 3<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> while the fdk reconstruction parameters are:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> --spacing 2,2,2 --dimension 250,100,250 --pad 0.1 --hann 0.5<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> The dimensions were chosen to include the entire anatomy. 72 projections<br>
>>>> were selected out of 646 projections for a 360 degree scan for both<br>
>>>> calculations.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> What parameters and how can I adjust (like alpha, beta, or iterations?)<br>
>>>> to improve the ADMMTV reconstruction? There is not much description of this<br>
>>>> application from the wiki page.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Thanks,<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> -howard<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>>> Rtk-users mailing list<br>
>>>> <a href="mailto:Rtk-users@public.kitware.com">Rtk-users@public.kitware.com</a><br>
>>>> <a href="http://public.kitware.com/mailman/listinfo/rtk-users" target="_blank">http://public.kitware.com/mailman/listinfo/rtk-users</a><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> --<br>
>>>> --<br>
>>>> Cyril Mory, Post-doc<br>
>>>> CREATIS<br>
>>>> Leon Berard cancer treatment center<br>
>>>> 28 rue Laënnec<br>
>>>> 69373 Lyon cedex 08 FRANCE<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B33%206%2069%2046%2073%2079" value="+33669467379">+33 6 69 46 73 79</a><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> --<br>
>>> --<br>
>>> Cyril Mory, Post-doc<br>
>>> CREATIS<br>
>>> Leon Berard cancer treatment center<br>
>>> 28 rue Laënnec<br>
>>> 69373 Lyon cedex 08 FRANCE<br>
>>><br>
>>> Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B33%206%2069%2046%2073%2079" value="+33669467379">+33 6 69 46 73 79</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> --<br>
>> --<br>
>> Cyril Mory, Post-doc<br>
>> CREATIS<br>
>> Leon Berard cancer treatment center<br>
>> 28 rue Laënnec<br>
>> 69373 Lyon cedex 08 FRANCE<br>
>><br>
>> Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B33%206%2069%2046%2073%2079" value="+33669467379">+33 6 69 46 73 79</a><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>